I found Captain Kidd's Treasure - Need help
seanengman:
This guy is trying to play everyone as an idiot. This sounds a lot like some Nigerian Scheme. He posts under an English flag, but can't even speak the language. Tell you what, I will sell you a real map to real treasure for $20... and if there are no takers I will die with my secret stash of pennies! Ha Ha Ha!
Peace
Sean
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tony69:
it is good to hear all your comments ,for many years i have wondered why all you people clame this and that and yet have nothing only a guess and a guess is not good enough i have facts and facts can prove what i say i have spent many years working on the charts and they work they really do work.to find treasure is one thing to get it is another, and being old i just thought it would be nice to put this matter to rest and get the treasure it would take a lot of money and a lot of experts i have the knowledge of were the treasure is ,and see no good in passing it on ,only to get the treasure ,ther comes a time in life were you must put your mony were your mouth is, this i can do and will do to the right person. any one can make up there own mind as to the charts, like the charts are fake or the charts are real ,if you think they are fake there must be a reason why you have come to this conclustion, to reach this verdic they have worked on there knowledge they have ,now if they think the charts are fake could it becouse that you can not work out how they work or have read books by some one who said they are fake and think what you read is true it must be true its in a book or have they gone down the wrong road to find treasure clowns .
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hardluck:
Hello Tony69
I am always interested in resaerch and others theories. However if you expect to be treated serious with your claims you have prove your discovery with supporting historical documents and a logical and rational theory.
Being old has nothing to do with it.There people on the site perhaps even older than you.
Since how you have not done this it pretty much sums up your claims that you have nothing to start with.
If you believe the maps are real then that's your prerogative. I wish you luck because you spend another 30 years dreaming.
Hardluck. :D
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Paul A:
Tony,
I pulled this from my reply to another thread about the Kidd Charts.
I suggest you read it. I would also suggest that you study the man rather than the myth.
Please do not refer to anyone on this forum as "Clowns" (this is certainly something they are NOT).
Don't let the facts get in the way of a good story eh?
1st Map
Hill ? Cutler (Antique dealer) was well known as a ?Bit of a rogue?
The Bureau in which the first ?Kidd map? was found dated to the mid 1700S!
How did Palmer find the map so easily? You would have though Hill-Cutler would have thoroughly inspected the bureau before selling it on?
The inscription on the bureau runner W.K. 1669 (1669?) is blatently a later addition.
The dating on the chart is wrong too (1669?)
X marks the spot? ?? ?Treasure Island? ........again??..
2nd Map
Hill-Cutler (again)
Once again, Hill-Cutler fails to find the ?Hidden Map?
The inscription on the chest is nearly right this time?. 1699, however, why a black flag and cutlass engraved on the lid from a man who swore to his dying breath that he was never a pirate and was acting under licence?
The Map is found hidden inside a book dated 1662 (remember, H-C is an antiques dealer) inside a false bottom secured by ?Cleverly disguised screws? ? Err?? screws weren?t in use until the mid 1700?S!!
3rd Map
Hill-Cutler is involved yet again (Can you see a pattern developing here?)
Apparently, a ?Dan Morgan? an ?old sea dog? from Bristol has replied to an advertisement placed by Hill-Cutler for ?Kidd stuff?
?"Respected sir,
As you seem keen for pirate stuff I have dug up something out of my attick wich may suit you it is a bit more Kidd stuff and hope you will like it I have been told Kidd was a kind gent and was murdered but when you see this thing I think you will say he was only a Bloody Pirate and deserved all he got I will try and hoble down end of the week sir so heres to 15 men on the dead mans chest and dont forgit the rum ile hav som you bet after the deal.
your obedant servant.
Dan Morgan?
(good grief??. Jack Sparrow couldn?t have done better!)
Well, well, well?.. a bit more detail on the map this time (a definite pattern appearing now?..)
4th Map
To Palmers Joy he now discovers the ?Key Map? inside a work box inscribed ?William and Sarah Kidd their box 1699? (1699 again?did Kidd have all his furnishings made in 1699?)
The map now has even more detail (or pure fantasy depending how you look at it)
Straight from the pages of ?Treasure Island?!
And the clincher is??? ?Smuggler? is NOT a term that would have been used in 1699!
?Smugglers? would have been referred to as ?Owlers? or ?Roquists?
My opinion ? Poor old Palmer was well and truly conned by H-C.
In an effort to save his reputation he carried on the legend and probably made a few quid out of it too!
This is the official line from the British library Map Room:
"[The Palmer-Kidd maps] ... are embellished with features that owe more to Robert Louis Stevenson's Treasure Island map ... notably ?Smugglers Cove' and the cryptic text. The former is unconvincing ... and the latter, frankly, pointless from the stand-point of use rather than parlour games."
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seanengman:
I believe any person who has spent any reasonable amount of time reading and studying any subject would be a bit more well versed. If you want to try and sell something would you do it dressed in homeless attire? Any good salesperson would at least put on a suit.
Peace
Sean
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bomber:
again tony,please share any info you can without being to specific,i understand completely that you just don't want to give it away but ceratinly that must be something you can share to help us understand a little.thank you
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tony69:
again i find people that are thick and cannot work out the charts ,well clues, some ask for, then slag me off as if I'm some kind of nut ,all because i have worked out how the charts work and can prove it, and they cant, it is so sad that people think this way ,if they are thick that is up to them , i have worked out the charts ,and if you new how they worked you would try to get the treasure as I'm trying ,and all i get from you people is that you are experts i would love to say how they work in order to shut the experts up and prove you all wrong but I'm enjoying this, when only one of you has brains and is on the right track of how the treasure was hid ,i will not prove to you people or give any clues ,i know ,and that's all that matters , telling you how they work to prove I'm not a nut is just what you want, like most of the people on the internet all trying to find Kidd's treasure saying they know when in fact they do not all guess work only guess work not facts. what I'm trying to do is get the treasure and as i said i need a backer it is to him that i have to prove know. and not you people. i will not tell so keep on thinking I'm nuts one day someone will back me and where will you all be, gone.all gone
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bomber:
can't say i didn't try.................good luck!
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seldom:
Tony how can you work out anything. When the charts are fake, a hoax, a drawing to sale books. The fact that they are fake has been proven time and time again. As said before there are many investors out there if you had anything of interest they would talk to you, and you would not be here asking strangers for money.
You are dealing with at least a dozen full time professional treasure hunters here several who have spend years researching Kidd and his charts, and all came to the same conclusion the charts are fake and Kidd left no treasure. Until you have new information you have zero, Sorry.
Your not the first person to think they have solved a big mystery only to find out there is no mystery, I suggest you do a little research before you start making off the wall claims.
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Paul A:
Tony,
No one is trying to pass themselves off as an expert.
Rather more, rational thinkers.
The web, and the world, is FULL to the brim with myths and legends.
Tales of untold riches appeal to all, but, you must consider the facts.
There is FAR more evidence that these charts are phoney than real.
Consider the facts:
The "charts" were all "found" in strict chronological order, ask yourself, what are the chances of that in reality?
In the case of the first chart, it was found in a MID 17th century bureau made some 50 years after Kidd had been hanged.
The dating was wrong on the chart also.
ALL the charts came via the same "source" - suspicious no? - each one adding just a little more detail
Please go back and read "treasure island" by Stephenson, an illustrated copy... take a look at the map.
The grammar and wording on these charts is utterly WRONG!
"Smuggler" is NOT a word that would have been in use until the MID or later 17th century.
The map room of the British Library has pronounced these as "fake" (or are they idiots as well?)
Wilkins maps are also fake - He admitted that himself!
It does not do yourself justice to go around pronouncing people as idiots because they do not agree with your point of view! I would urge you to study more carefully Kidds life and the transcript (full) of his trial proceedings.
If you are convinced these "charts" work, then CONVINCE us of their authenticity. You have nothing to lose by that.
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