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Offline GeofizTopic starter
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« on: September 18, 2010, 11:22:00 am »
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Hi all,

New to this site so sorry if treading on toes here or in the wrong area..

Looking for a decent design for a field Gradiometer (Like a Geoscan FM256 etc) with code for the logger and also some open source plotting SW or decent freeware along the lines of Geoplot3. Would settle for a downloader to go into Surfer if pushed.
Anyone know if there are any plans / links or project running for this?

Thanks
Geofiz

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Offline GoldDigger1950
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« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2010, 02:57:29 am »
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That's a fairly complicated project, mate. I can't recall seeing any plans for such a device. There is a nice plan for an Earth Resistivity Logger here in the downloads section which can also be found on the Geotech forums, if you can't wait that long.

Welcome from Australia, by the way.

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« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2010, 11:05:47 am »
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Hi GD

They're not too bad, but used to work with a guy who was a really good embedded coder. We were going to build one a few years ago. Then I moved jobs and as I don't write code, so I am a bit lost now. Can do the electronics and mechanical bit.
Really good bits of kit but most of it is logger and GUI display code.
Was hoping someone may have had a bash at one or something similar.

We did a lot of work with Buried Fluxgate Earth Magnetometers in 3 axis. Worked really well. Very stable and better that 0.1 nT.  He wrote a nice GUI display for it too. Should have stayed with the old job, I guess!!
Want to build a Resitivity rig too, so thanks for the pointer.
Am into Archaeology Geophysics, hence the Gradi project.  If I get one going, I will post the details on the site then!!

Thanks for the reply. Appreciated.

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Offline GoldDigger1950
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2010, 11:23:00 am »
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You're going about it the right way and I wish you luck. Let me suggest using SourceForge for your project. What you do is go there, set up a project after you write the technical specification for it and post a sort of "help wanted" for interested parties to join in on the development. You can post your invitations here and on other forums and newsgroups where interested parties may be. Not just the treasure hunters, either. You get guys and gals who live for writing code who are fascinated by the right project. SourceForge also allows you to go public with your request for assistance and you'll be surprised at the amount of interest.

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When you go there, it looks like a software only site but some of the projects have involved embedded coding for logic analyzers, spectrum analyzers and PC based oscilloscope hardware. Basically, if you can define it, you can get a crew together from all over the world. You do the hardware and get assistance with the coding. During the process of gathering your help, you vet them just like for any other paying job, but this one is for free. If, and this is up to you, you decide to take the project to manufacture, you can form a "for profit" partnership with those who helped. If you plan to do that, I suggest you not make the project a public one.

Another route to go is to set up a project site somewhere and ask for people much the same way. This would have to be hosted somewhere using server side scripting and perhaps a member only blog where status reports can be made.

I'm retired from electronics engineering and I specialized in embedded control. I know what you are up against. This Internet thing has transformed the world since my day. What used to take me years to assemble, in terms of a good design team, takes only a week or so now.

In other words, you've come to the right place, mate.

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« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2010, 01:56:10 pm »
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Hi GD

Thanks for the advice.
Had never considered Sourceforge in that way. At this stage, I am not looking to commercialise it, but I did nearly start a business with the Magnetometer, HF Radio Telescopes and Seismometry projects we had going.
Shame really, they were really advanced but we never carried it forward due to lack of time.

Will give Sourceforge a go and see what turns up!
Great post.. Thanks again
Geofiz

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« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2010, 02:11:32 pm »
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Back in the days of MS-DOS (Remember those days?) I built a telescope controller for a friend of mine who had a piece of property out in the desert in San Diego county. The altitude was fairly high and the weather mostly clear. He'd go out there and fly model rockets in the day time and use his scope at night. I'd go out with him for the fun of it and to do a bit of poking around.

It wasn't long before we took on building an observatory building and then automated it. We used some rather sophisticated open frequencies to set up a remote control system to open the observatory and position the scope. At the time, digital cameras were unheard of so we used a Ham channel and an analog camera to see the images. Really primitive but fun. He also had a film camera that he used where he had to go get the film later. Today, that same system with more modern firmware and software is doing him good service. Digital cameras and a second scope using my motor drive system are in place. It's sort of like having your own Hubble.

All this happened back in the early '80s. We're still good friends and we get together now and again for a private, on-line star party.

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« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2010, 02:32:14 pm »
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I used to do similar stuff. Been a Radio Ham since 1980, though not active these days. My background is RF and antenna engineering though I do more business management and paperwork these days.
Did a lot with early Weather Sat when it was mostly analogue and all live! Good fun.
Get very little time to play these days. Still and Engineer at heart.
My daughter has just gone to University to do Forensic Archaeology. As we are both interested in Geophysics and Archaeology, seemed natural to knock up a few instruments!
The Gradiometer has proved ellusive to my suprise as its a very good tool to use. Thought more folk would be building them.
Once you have the front end sorted, the remainder is similar to a resistivity set in the logging, downloading and plotting.
I devised a nice protocol for logging it all such that you can combine GPS at the instrument and refernce the position at each end of a run. That can then be overlayed on a GIS with a map etc. Makes quick surveys much easier without the need to survey to the n'th degree.
Dare say I will get there in the end!
Was having a go at astronomy too, building a big dobsonian with large stepper drives. Felt that that wasn't the best route and should have gone for servos to get the slewing right. Another parked project!!! We all have 'em!

G


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« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2010, 02:37:27 pm »
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Steppers are all right for the job as long as you gear them heavily to increase the resolution.

Have you selected a datalogger yet? Front end design specs written? Sounds like it's high time you started a project, mate. I'm retired from electronics engineering. I specialized in embedded control.

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« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2010, 03:56:12 pm »
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Haven't designed it yet. Plan was to build from scratch. Can do the PCB layout and Schematics OK, but then it gets sticky. No point in choosing a Micro / Memory etc unless you know that the guy who will code it is happy with the architecture!
My preference would be an Atmel AVR or a big PIC and a lot of Flash. Plan to take continuous readings and average at desired intervals in at least 10bit resolution.
If you reckon on a 30 x 30mtr grid and storing averaged readings at the rate of 10- 40 per meter then you generate a reasonable amount of data. Adding geo data, time stamps, direction, mode, status etc makes for a long data string per stored value.
Logger would have to take the magnetic data in at 8 or 10 bits wide words and then add serial / TTL data from the GPS. The Processor must maintain and add a decent clock, synced by the GPS from time to time and input the external flags and status.
Store that lot per survey with outputs to an LCD or OLED display.
Finally, download preferably via USB to a PC or similar. That leaves a download app plus the Main GUI / Plot code! 
Getting the magnetics and signal to the processor is the easy bit! ith the rest thats tricky!!!
G

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« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2010, 01:50:56 am »
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Hi G.,

Quoting you.
<Getting the magnetics and signal to the processor is the easy bit! ith the rest thats tricky!!!>

I am not so sure about this. Believe me, I went through all that experience and it was quite the reverse. Displaying the results on a simple LCD or even on a GUI and storing them on an SD Card for example IS EASY nowadays.
<Getting the magnetics> is the first BIG problem.
Processing the digitized signal to get a good accuracy in terms of nT's is the second BIG problem.

Willy

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