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Offline Homefire
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« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2011, 11:35:16 am »
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Reg!   Not to get to far off subject but maybe you can help on this one.

It's Brain Picken Time!  LOL!

Do you know of any programs I can use to draw a Spiral Coil with?

Looking to build something like this:



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Offline xavier
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« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2011, 11:40:38 am »
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Sorry to hear about you loss I do hope that you will be able to sort out all of those irritating issues. I am not looking to be able to distinguish gold from an other alloy at this time all I'm tying to do is to have a ferrous and non ferrous signal(audio)  wolff Was the one that wanted to know what would be the best detector for gold. Also I'm not asking you for a design but rather for some ideas on the way to go about it and tackle the problem this will not only help me but other members if not now then perhaps in the future.

Wishing you well
Xavier 

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« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2011, 12:17:05 pm »
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I only brought up my personal issues because there will be people who will probably attack me much like they do Dave Emery since I haven't brought out my concept.  I have made a statement of what I feel I can do but since I haven't done so, I fully expect flack.  Personally, now I don't care either way since I answer to no one now.  Whether I even complete the project is something I can't answer at this time.  The loss of my significant other right after the death of my father was the last straw for me. 

Now, as for the question about a drawing program to draw a spiral coil, personally, I don't know of one.  I don't use spiral coils.  Instead, I find I can get the response and depth from a conventionally built coil using Teflon coated wire to help with the coil speed concerns. 

For those of you trying for the earliest sampling time, there is a relationship between the coil design and the damping resistor that few fully realize.  Build a coil using Teflon coated wire and it is quite possible one can increase the size of the damping resistor.  This combination can and usually will result in a faster dampening of the decay signal. 

Leave the damping resistor the same but use Teflon coated wire may not show any improvement and in some cases may actually appear to be slower.  I won't go into the details as to why this happens but I did experiment and prove it can happen. 

Now, change the insulation or stated differently, the voltage rating of the Teflon wire and again, you change the coil dynamics.  In other words, a coil made with 1000V insulation rating may require a larger valued damping resistor to obtain the best results. 

So, how does this help determining gold from ferrous junk?  Well, I won't divulge some tricks I did some time back that allowed me to determine small thin ferrous junk from gold, but I will say sampling earlier and later and looking at the signals will help.  At least it does for certain types of ferrous junk. 

Here are a couple of things to keep in mind.  First, ferrous signals are much stronger than gold signals for corresponding similar size objects.  Generally, gold responses are mellow when compared to ferrous signals.  When using a  mono coil, ferrous objects can easily generate a double blip type response, especially if the ferrous junk is long and narrow such as a boby pin or a nail.  Gold, as a general rule will not do that. 

If a ground balancing detector is designed that is similar to the TDI, then gold will usually have a repeatable level at which it is nulled or balanced out.  Ferrous junk can vary as you move around the object to make your analysis. 

Now, these are a few obvious observations.  Others can be found and should be looked for by the operator of the detector.  Be careful when first learning because what might appear to be true often isn't.

Reg



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« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2011, 01:05:39 pm »
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Once again a very interesting post but you did not answer my question  Sad what is the simplest way to differentiate ferrous from non ferrous using audio?

Regards Xavier

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« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2011, 03:43:27 pm »
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Design a method that determines when an object is ferrous and then simply shut off the audio using that signal.  If it were simple, it would have been done by now.  So, to answer your question, there is no way to do what you want at this time that I know of.  Unfortunately, that is what I have been trying to say all along, except I didn't explain about shutting off the audio.

Reg

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« Reply #15 on: April 17, 2011, 03:47:06 am »
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OK so that makes a lot of sense thanks for the answer I appreciate it.

Regards Xavier

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« Reply #16 on: April 17, 2011, 04:03:53 am »
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Excuse me butting in on this Xavier, as you might know already the Minelab has differant soil timings
But the New Whites TDI PRO you can fine tune the soil/speed in order to disc criminate and if you wish
I could send you 1 users story on the machines responces and how he sets it up

AU

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« Reply #17 on: April 17, 2011, 04:22:04 am »
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Hi Ridge Runner

Yes please do it's all ways interesting to have an insight of how the others are setting up. I also have got different timing on my PI on the [on time] and the [off time] but for it to be stable I will have to get top quality pots these carbon pots don't seem to do the trick but money is tight at the moment so I'm concentrating on new ideas and designs (digital) what I would like to do is have three or four settings for example sandy (beech) rocky, highly mineralised soil and so on but this is no simple task.

All the best
Xavier 

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« Reply #18 on: April 17, 2011, 04:50:04 am »
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Xavier I have sent you an email, I've got more here

AU

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« Reply #19 on: April 17, 2011, 04:57:11 am »
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Thanks Ridge Runner I will be taking a look at it now.

Regards Xavier

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