[x] Welcome at THunting.com!

A fun place to talk about Metal Detecting, Treasure Hunting & Prospecting. Here you can share finds and experience with thousands of members from all over the world

Join us and Register Now - Its FREE & EASY

THunting.com
Treasure Hunting & Metal Detecting Community
   
Advanced Search
*
Welcome, Guest! Please login or register HERE - It is FREE and easy.
Only registered users can post and view images on our message boards.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with email, password and session length
Or Login Using Social Network Account
2
News:
Pages:  1 2 3   Go Down
Print
Share this topic on FacebookShare this topic on Del.icio.usShare this topic on DiggShare this topic on RedditShare this topic on Twitter
Tags:
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Offline GollumTopic starter
Pull Tab
*

Join Date: Feb, 2007
Thank you0

Activity
0%

United States
Posts: 9
Referrals: 0

75.00 Gold
View Inventory

WWW Awards

Minelab XTerra 70, Fisher Gemini, SD2000 Heavily Modded, Excalibur, Foster AquaSearch
« on: March 04, 2008, 05:46:18 pm »
Go Up Go Down

After years of research and wearing out boot leather (or accidentally tripping over it while on a day hike), you are blessed with chest upon chest of gold bars, coins, or whatever.........................NOW WHAT DO YOU DO?

Keep it a secret? Call the local paper/TV Station?Get drunk? EVERY option I give you will be fraught with positives and negatives. I am simply posting this as food for thought for all you erstwhile Treasure Hunters out there. This is also something you should most definitely plan for in the beginning of your research.

With all the Parks (State and National), the chances of your long lost treasure being found on Public Property is the greatest, so we'll work from that assumption.

First, let's explore what most of us would first think to do if confronted with a large cache of treasure: KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT! Even though it's on public land, you found it, and it's all yours (refer to the trial of Finders vs. Keepers). And lets say for ease of typing (mine), that you can easily dig it out and get it home. Your problems have only just begun. Do you sit on it, or try and get rid of it? Do you get rid of it all at once, or do you parcel it out a little at a time? What do you do with all the money? You can't simply deposit it in your account. You can't go out and buy that new $100,000 Range Rover. You can't buy that big new house, or the boat, or the airplane. Why? Because ANY transaction in which someone uses $10,000 or more in cash has to be reported to the Federal Government. There is a form specifically for this. It is IRS Form 8300 (in the box on the top right corner it is also referred to as Dept. of the Treasury Financial Crimes Enforcement Network Form 8300). Google it./ You as the buyer will never see it. The business you buy the item from will file it through the IRS.

Once the IRS gets it, they will quickly run it against your Income Tax Records for the last few years to see if you make the amount of money necessary for that $100,000 cash purchase. When they see that you have consistently reported your income as $25,000 per year from your job at WalMart, red flags go up, and sirens start howling. Why? The Feds' first thought is that you are either selling drugs, are a terrorist, or are doing something else illegal. At the very least you will appear to have been DRASTICALLY underreporting you yearly income. Your name is now Red Flagged and given either to an IRS Investigator or an Investigator from the Dept. of Justice/Treasury/Secret Service/Homeland Security (take your pick, it doesn't really matter). Now, they begin to crawl up your behind with a microscope. Your life is now an open book. Think you'll get caught? Most likely. IRS Form 8300 was initially used to catch Drug Dealers and Money Launderers. It can (and has) been used just as easily to catch a successful (but incautious) treasure hunter. I would give the average Joe/Jane about a 15% chance of getting away clean.

Now, lets explore doing this the right way (legally). It has some pretty horrendous drawbacks as well. Say, you find your cache. You, being Mr/Ms. Upright John/Joan Q. Public want to do the right thing and be able to publicly take credit for your find. You make the requisite calls and find out that you must file for a Treasure Trove Permit. To receive this, you must first do several things. First thing is to prove you have actually found something. You need to speak with the Chief Archaeologist or Ranger. If you convince them, it makes your job much easier. You will need to file a plan of action regarding what type of digging you will be doing, and what type of equipment you will need. You will also need to have the site archaeologically surveyed to determine if there is anything there of historical significance (if there is, kiss you dig permit goodbye). All of the aforementioned things must be paid for out of your pocket. This first part can easily take a year or two. Everything is going okay, and you are all approved now. Before you can sink the first shovel, you will need to file a Reclamation Bond with either the BLM or the Forest Service (whomever is administering your site). The amount of this bond is mostly based on public access to the area and how much your digging will disturb the area. It can be anywhere from $500 to $500,000.

I forgot to mention one little detail. You will need to negotiate a deal with Uncle Sam for how much of your find you will get to keep. Get an attorney experienced in doing this (negotiating government contracts). I will tell you now, that the best you will probably get is a 50/50 split, with ALL the costs of EVERYTHING coming out of your 50%. Then, you will be required to show your find as earned income, which will rocket you(that year anyway) into the 50% tax bracket (State and Federal). Using this method, you MAY get away with about 10-15% of whatever your cache was worth.

Do you still want to be a Treasure Hunter?  Huh? Huh? Huh?

There are a ton more variables, but I can only type so much. Just think of the lawyers fees you will be paying for them to fight the Spanish Government, The Jesuit Order, the descendants of the people who hid your fortune. That won't be cheap either.

Best-Mike

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg19826.html#msg19826




« Last Edit: March 04, 2008, 05:51:03 pm by Gollum »
Logged

See my work at:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

www.1oro1.com

Offline stringfrenzy
Gold Member
*

I love THunting
Join Date: Jul, 2006
Thank you3

Activity
0%
Male
United States
Posts: 3448
Referrals: 0

19277.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

E-Trac W/X-1 White's DFX  W/4x6 shooter/950 Eclipse/Super 12/Bigfoot/DX-1 BHID Garrett Ultra GTAx 1000             R.A.T.Phones Max
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2008, 08:13:30 pm »
Go Up Go Down

Welcome to the thunting forum Gollum.  This is an interesting post you have made here and should be very interesting to see some responses to it.  In a situation such as this there are pros and cons no matter which way a person would decide to go.  Very interesting topic.  Thanks for the post.

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg19827.html#msg19827


Stringfrenzy


Logged
Offline stringfrenzy
Gold Member
*

I love THunting
Join Date: Jul, 2006
Thank you3

Activity
0%
Male
United States
Posts: 3448
Referrals: 0

19277.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

E-Trac W/X-1 White's DFX  W/4x6 shooter/950 Eclipse/Super 12/Bigfoot/DX-1 BHID Garrett Ultra GTAx 1000             R.A.T.Phones Max
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2008, 07:24:38 am »
Go Up Go Down

Very good points.  A lot of people can't go against companies and organizations like that and I'm sure we all know how the spanish government can be about recovered items.  It is definately food for thought for some of us.  I will certainly have to keep an eye on this topic.  Great post. 

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg19834.html#msg19834


Stringfrenzy


Logged
Offline cal1062
Copper Member
*

Join Date: Mar, 2009
Thank you0

Activity
0%
Male
United States
Posts: 57
Referrals: 0

295.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

bounty hunter
« Reply #3 on: March 11, 2009, 06:01:16 pm »
Go Up Go Down

cool post and welcome

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg26732.html#msg26732




Logged
Offline usmcman
Bronze Member
*

Join Date: Feb, 2009
Thank you0

Activity
0%

United States
Posts: 396
Referrals: 0

1080.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2009, 07:59:28 am »
Go Up Go Down

Nice but the first thing I would do as is if I won the lottery is get a lawyer.

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg26777.html#msg26777




Logged
Offline Treasurehunter01253
Silver Member
*

Join Date: Jan, 2009
Thank you0

Activity
0%
Male
United States
Posts: 517
Referrals: 0

2470.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

9 function discrminator, Sears discriminator.
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2009, 01:22:59 pm »
Go Up Go Down

Hello Gollum,   
                   Welcome to the thunting forum, I hope you enjoy the forum,
As to your post it is very interesting indeed thank you for posting it. It dose leave one with a perplexing question to one self. But as one posted earlier, like hitting the lottery consult with a Lawyer!! Best Wishes.....Rob


Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg26807.html#msg26807




Logged
Offline Bud
Copper Member
*

Join Date: Dec, 2006
Thank you1

Activity
0%

United States
Posts: 49
Referrals: 0

240.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

Minelab-XT17000/Explorer
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2009, 03:00:28 pm »
Go Up Go Down

Hey Gollum, where have you been for a year?

You didn't specify, a big key is to make sure any VISIBLE transactions are BELOW $10,000. This means, you can not get greedy. Stretch things out. Travel a bit and sell at gold and coin shows. Private collectors can be found by attending accredited coin AUCTIONS (the 'big guns' buy 'planked' coins). You will have to discount the actual value to entice a buyer to write a check and cash it AT YOUR BANK so you can trade your finds for money and put it in a deposit box. Everything MUST be done in cash, NO checks thank you. Then you make good use of a safe-deposit box, not a bank account.


if you have cash as a 'back-up', you can buy that $100,000 car or $500,000 house ON TIME....No 'red flags' here. Visibly, you are just an idiot who over- extended himself. According to the current Gov. this is the American way and Uncle Sam will bail you out....with someone else's money.

An important point; seeing as you are dealing in cash, you will need to do substantial research on the people you deal with. Trust no one. This.....brings my...wandering 'cart', behind the 'horse', where it belongs.

FIRST....after the FIND. KEEP YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH SHUT!!! You do not post it on your favorite forum! You do not tell your best friend (who you trust for silence)! You threaten your spouse  with death (or worse) if she talks!.......All this is imperative!

A case in point; A buddy of mine (poor, stupid buddy) lives in an old house....ninety years old. He found a cache of coins in his BACK YARD (about three thousand $ face value, no key dates thank God) and before long an article was in his local paper. He is now talking to lawyers of the prior owner AND the decendants of people who owned the property as a farm.....and died fifty years ago....and yes the IRS is dancing around the trio of lawyers. While you are laughing, I am merely shaking my head in amazement.

You talk about Mr. and Mrs. Upright John/Joan Public and how you are 'supposed' to react to a windfall.....Sorry pal, Back when I was a kid and still believed in the 'American Way', this was a given. NOW, with all the crap concerning Fanny Mae/Freddy Mac and the dollars.... paid to my Representatives in Gov. by lobbyists to RIP me off,....you are talking to my deaf side about what is fair and equitable. I pay my taxes for my job of work, and always have, BUT these clowns are not going to squeeze me for my recreation if I can help it.......But, that's just me!

Bud

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg26954.html#msg26954




Logged
Offline aussie
Bronze Member
*

Join Date: Mar, 2009
Thank you1

Activity
0%
Male
Australia
Posts: 279
Referrals: 0

1415.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

Minelab GP Extreme  / Bounty Hunter/Minelab ETrac
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2009, 03:54:39 am »
Go Up Go Down

Hi Gollum
                 Youve opened up a can of worms here .  Any time I had a bit of under the table cash the advice given to me by my comrades , is go and blow it on a nice long holiday somewhere in the South Pacific because you cant put it in the bank . Over here Australia that is we dont have to pay tax on any winnings being horses ,lotto or whatever , maybe you could sink a bit of cash into lotto then if you were lucky enough to win the 20million jackpot youd be home free because your win would be accountable , legal and tax free . Thats what I would do anyway .  lol

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg28431.html#msg28431




Logged
Offline prairiemonster
Pull Tab
*

Join Date: Mar, 2009
Thank you0

Activity
0%

United States
Posts: 7
Referrals: 0

55.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards

tesoro,minelab,rods
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2009, 07:54:21 am »
Go Up Go Down

I would not waste my time thinking about something that may never happen [funny]LOL.
If you do get lucky,like everyone else has said,KEEP YOUR BIG MOUTH SHUT!!!
There is alot of people in this world that will buy your finds and keep there mouth shut too,they do not want to be robbed/known or taxed either.Bury it just like the old timers used to do and spend it a little at a time if it's a spendable type,if not then you might have to sell.
Another way is to barter, trade, swap and etc.You need to remember that IRS only knows what you are someone else tells them,they are not out there looking for YOU.
If you want to be well known and famous and your finds have great value and you do not want to be taxed are have other people claim it then this is what you have to do.Donate it to a museum and just not any museum but your very own just like Mel Fisher had to do. Great
If all this to much for you then just give to me. Crazy

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg28646.html#msg28646




Logged
Offline seldom
Wrecking Crew
Platin Member
*

Wrecking Crew
Join Date: Jan, 2009
Thank you19

Activity
0%
Male
United States
Posts: 7361
Referrals: 0

20755.00 Gold
View Inventory

Awards
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2009, 06:00:34 am »
Go Up Go Down

 My wife owns a antique shop so I can sale thing a few at a time Thu her. Yes I have to pay taxes but get few questions large treasures are a different problem. But if you have this problem just keep ouit and work it out.
 #0 years ago I was hunting Padre Island and finding 10 to 12 1553 2 reales a week selling them for 60 to 200 each. Long story but before it was over word got out and I had ever state and fed agent you can think of at my door. NOT NICE. So like everyone says KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT

Linkback:

You are not allowed to view links.
Please Register or Login

http://www.thunting.com/smf/index.php/topic,2512.msg28742.html#msg28742




Logged

If you believe everything you read you are reading to much.
Treasure is a Harsh  Mistress

Print
Pages:  1 2 3   Go Up
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2005, Simple Machines | Sitemap
Copyright THunting.com