Schematic for trade...

seldom

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #10 on: January 05, 2010, 04:15:11 pm »

	Quote:	Posted by Christian
Good bye!

We get lots of good new members everyday, guess we can not make everyone happy

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #11 on: January 09, 2010, 04:24:25 am »

	Quote:	Posted by seldom
We get lots of good new members everyday, guess we can not make everyone happy

Wow, lot's of thin skinned people around! It really is irrelevant that somebody should want to trade something they worked on and created, no matter what it is. It's unfortunate that Cornelius' sensibilities got offended over something that in the end doesn't matter a whit. There are other schematics around for this very machine!

I notice there really aren't that many technical minded people around such as Olerelic. Little is gained by chasing them off because they broke some fantasy rule. And so much as lots of people coming around, I noticed that too. But at the same time, not as many stay to be regular posters.

I encourage Olerelic to go to the geotech boards. That community is far more serious toward the nitty gritty of how machines work anyhow.

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #12 on: January 09, 2010, 04:41:45 am »

Just a side note: I had hosted the Geotech Forum for many years. Carl always encourage the free trade of information that is offering something without asking for anything in exchange. If this board was like "I gave you somthing if you got something I want" ... then especially the beginner would not be able to pick up anything at all.

Hence I feel it is important that information ought to be offered FREE of change. Otherwise it should be taken to a commercially oriented board - which Geotech - for god sake - isn't, too.

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #13 on: January 09, 2010, 05:32:24 am »

Even more importantly, Christian, reverse engineering can in come cases be theft of intellectual property. Even while admitting he did just that, he declares that because HE reverse engineered it, it wasn't intellectual property.

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #14 on: January 09, 2010, 04:57:17 pm »

	Quote:	Posted by GoldDigger1950
Even more importantly, Christian, reverse engineering can in come cases be theft of intellectual property. Even while admitting he did just that, he declares that because HE reverse engineered it, it wasn't intellectual property.

Actually it's not. The Troy machines are not protected by patents (indeed they copy designs from others!). And circuit boards (being devices) can't be protected by copyright anyway - hence the reason why he did nothing wrong by tracing a schematic for his machine!

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #15 on: January 09, 2010, 05:07:18 pm »

	Quote:	Posted by technos
Actually it's not. The Troy machines are not protected by patents (indeed they copy designs from others!). And circuit boards (being devices) can't be protected by copyright anyway - hence the reason why he did nothing wrong by tracing a schematic for his machine!

Don't become a proponent of ignoring intellectual property rights. It's probably already too late for you. Intellectual property has never been the sole domain of the patent. It belongs to the creator and the term is applied by the creator. No amount of copyright or patenting assigns that status to it. It's automatic. I have written these few lines and they are MY intellectual property just like your few lines are yours.

Copying someone else's design and reselling it is theft of intellectual property. It may not be illegal to steal it but it certainly is immoral. Stealing it while it is still in copyright or patent is illegal. Stealing it afterward is immoral. Either way, this should not be done here in these forums. It cheapens them.

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #16 on: January 09, 2010, 05:54:17 pm »

	Quote:	Posted by GoldDigger1950
Copying someone else's design and reselling it is theft of intellectual property. It may not be illegal to steal it.....

Gee golddigger1950, if it's not illegal, then it's not theft. Wow, you managed to kill your own argument within the space of three words. Grin

	Quote:	Posted by GoldDigger1950
but it certainly is immoral..... Stealing it afterward is immoral.

I bet that there are dozens of corporate attorneys that read this forum so they can squeal with glee at your posts. According to your line of thinking, every time I create fire, I'd be stealing from the cave man. The same goes for things like the wheel, pencils, and we'd still be paying royalties to Edison for his work on the light bulb (may he rest in peace).

	Quote:	Posted by GoldDigger1950
Stealing it while it is still in copyright or patent is illegal.

Tracing a schematic to a machine protected by a patent is not illegal (which the Troy machines aren't BTW), for the same reason that

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these guys can publish a "schematic" to a car

.

I don't think that encouraging patent or copyright violations is right. But the fact is that most of this technology has fallen in the public domain, and it's why you see a dozen different metal detector companies. They all use pretty much the same technology now.

Without rehashing a previous thread you and I had Shocked

- not understanding that patents do expire, and expire for a reason, so that the technology might be reused by others, is what's wrong. Also note copyrights are a different subject, but devices (and circuit boards) fall under the realm of patents, and are not protected by copyright.

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GoldDigger1950

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #17 on: January 09, 2010, 08:44:47 pm »

Why do you presume that theft is illegal? It can, as I point out, be simply immoral. Your brain is miswired, mate. Copying someone else's schematic diagram without permission or reverse engineering it is theft. Selling it or trading it here is just not allowed. Get over it.

FYI, patents can be renewed. And updated. And changed. Without ever giving up ownership. But then, since you haven't got any, that becomes a question of theory for you.

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	Re: Schematic for trade... « Reply #18 on: January 10, 2010, 06:48:08 am »

you can look at an electronic device and draw a schematic, description, repair/maintanance tips etc. all legal as long as you give proper credit(dont claim its your idea) an sell or trade it. you may not photo copy a copyrighted manual and sell/trade it that includes a tracing of a patented pc board.
you can make a copy of a patented device for you personal use, but not to sell.
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