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Offline Rational Observer
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« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2010, 05:17:16 pm »
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Quote:Posted by Idaho Jones
There is also the operator error question. Was it confirmed that the silver nitrate was the issue or simply assumed?

The only thing to take away from that test is the lesson on how not to test something imo  Grin




Reading the posts on that forum, nothing was dug...one way or the other to confirm what the "false target(s)" could have been. Simply assumed would be the proper assumption

Had the silver dollars been found...would the test still be considered as flawed, or a success?




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Offline GoldDigger1950
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« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2010, 08:32:07 pm »
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Quote:Posted by Rational Observer
Reading the posts on that forum, nothing was dug...one way or the other to confirm what the "false target(s)" could have been. Simply assumed would be the proper assumption

Had the silver dollars been found...would the test still be considered as flawed, or a success?


You seem to be a bit off your game, RO. Assumed an assumption? Oh, dear.

The test is either flawed or not flawed. Beyond that, it either succeeds or fails. The two are mutually exclusive in this discussion. A flawed test can succeed in spite of being flawed. A test that is not flawed can fail. Your question makes no sense, mate.

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« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2010, 11:19:05 pm »
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Validity in a test can only come with repeatability. You can't rule out blind luck in a single find, so the only way to define how accurate the machine is would be to average success rates over multiple searches.

Testing something once with flawed methods regardless of outcome is just as bad as doctoring statistics to show higher than actual success if you are publishing data. Garbage in garbage out.

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« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2010, 02:50:18 am »
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Quote:Posted by GoldDigger1950
You seem to be a bit off your game, RO. Assumed an assumption? Oh, dear.

The test is either flawed or not flawed. Beyond that, it either succeeds or fails. The two are mutually exclusive in this discussion. A flawed test can succeed in spite of being flawed. A test that is not flawed can fail. Your question makes no sense, mate.


Although my question makes no sense, had the dowsing wand found the silver dollar...it would have been celebrated as a success by the believers. Because the dowsing wand did not succeed in performing as the owner claimed, the test was flawed...of course.

Guys...we are not talking about the validity of a scientific test here. Of course the test held no scientific merit, it was a casual test of someone claiming they could do something we all know is impossible. I am actually surprised the Mid-West rep for H3 Tec even attempted this

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Offline GoldDigger1950
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« Reply #34 on: August 06, 2010, 04:31:27 am »
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Quote:Posted by Rational Observer
Although my question makes no sense, had the dowsing wand found the silver dollar...it would have been celebrated as a success by the believers. Because the dowsing wand did not succeed in performing as the owner claimed, the test was flawed...of course.

Guys...we are not talking about the validity of a scientific test here. Of course the test held no scientific merit, it was a casual test of someone claiming they could do something we all know is impossible. I am actually surprised the Mid-West rep for H3 Tec even attempted this


To be truthful, RO, if I hid the coin and he found it in a two acre field, I'd be inclined to believe him. If he did it again, it would prove it to me beyond a doubt. To me. Only me. I'm hard to fool. But you, as an outside observer, would be foolish to take my testimony alone.

I still don't believe in dowsing or LRLs.

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« Reply #35 on: August 06, 2010, 04:59:34 pm »
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Honestly if I was an inventor and came across a process to find treasure as it's claimed, I wouldn't tell anyone until I had all the gold I wanted then I would give the technology away to the public. That's why I am sceptical of anyone selling super treasure finders. Why would you need to sell them? I have no doubt that someday some smart person will stumble onto one though.

As they used to say at a company I once worked for, "Impossible just takes us a little longer."

Nikola Tesla was told he could never make an alternating current motor. Scientists then thought they knew what was possible and not. It's a darn good thing he didn't listen or this might be a DC only world  Grin

As to your question RO I think anyone selling something is not a good subject to test as bias is inevitable. Maybe he actually believes in the product he's selling?  Undecided

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« Reply #36 on: August 15, 2010, 10:28:14 am »
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I have recently wrapped up a 2-month detailed investigation of the H3Tec, including a full dissection. It is nothing but a dowsing rod. As such, it obviously could not detect gold or silver or anything else (yes, I ran tests). It does have a real circuit inside (unlike so many LRLs that don't) but the circuitry doesn't really do anything, other than look high-tech and make the buyers feel they got more for their $10,000 than just a dowsing rod.

I have offered my $25,000 to Mr. Christensen if he can successfully demonstrate the device but so far all I've gotten back are legal threats and a lot of foot stomping.



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« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2010, 02:44:43 pm »
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Thank you for your post, Carl-NC...

In my lastest post, I said I wouldn't say anything else about the H3 or H3tec... but this posting by Carl absolutely requires a comment due to its one sided, and biased and untruthfull comments

From these comments, are the readers to assume you are an expert, with well documented education  in electronic, magnetism,  molecular and atomic structures, computer science, hardware and software with a great working understanding of several languages as well as mechanical engineering??? 

...because you would need to be well versed in all those academic subjects along with several others to stumble onto the the basis of the technology behind the H3... Mr Christensen is extremely well educated, in those fields and much more...DOWSING HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SUCCESS OF THE H3....it is truly scientific....

You did say one thing truthfully... The H3 doesn't find gold or silver.... but it does see the molecular structure of ANY element on the periodic table and any compound made from those elements...It sees, or more precisely..hears... at the molecular level... not the reflected signal of pulse induction as it were....if it is programed to "HEAR" the molecular structure of gold, and it hears that structure... when you dig where it indicated to dig...., there WILL be gold there.... but it doesn't see or hear gold as a typical modern metal detector does....

It would be helpful for you to tell the truth and the complete story... You left out the part where you contacted me personally and I, as well and Mr, Christensen have extended SEVERAL offers to you to come to Salt Lake City for a complete demonstration on the H3 and yet each time you have declined to do so... I still have the emails in my personal account and I can publish them for all to see that while legal issues have come and are coming about for you between yourself and H3tec... these came about ONLY after you declined several invitations and several request to stop saying negative things about the H3 and H3tec without the proper information to back up your statements... largely due to lack of your knowledge on the H3 and its patented technology....of which H3tec owns all the patents, of which there are MANY.......

Since you have $25,000 to use as a reward for a successful demonstration, why haven't you... or better yet, why don't you simply go to Salt Lake City for a demonstration, it is FREE other than your transportation and lodging and food....It certainly wouldn't cost $25,000 to go the SLC, to prove your point....

I will make the following offer....to ANYONE... (there are also dealers in Southern California as well as in Ohio and Slat Lake City.....contact H3tec for their contact information)
 
I live in the Corpus Christi area of TX... and I will demonstrate and TEACH you how to properly use the H3... and you WILL find things a regular metal detector cannot find....All anyone has to do is contat me and set up an appointment....you pay for your transportation, food and lodging....

I am an authorized dealer for the H3 and H3tec... my territory covers all the southern states, LA to AZ and from CO southward... I have been properly trained and understand the H3e very, very well....and have also been successful with it too....

I met a woman when I was in High school, soo many decades ago, who could remember, as a small child, her parents speaking of the American Civil war... and she remember the great advance of the Telegraph, the rail road, and then there was the sinking of the USS Main and the Spanish American war... as well as WWI and WWII... the invention of electricity, the telephone... the first airplane flight..as well as actually flying in one once... the Korean war and the Viet Nam war.. and modern fighting armies---not bows and arrows..... she died shortly after man walked on the moon... Just imagine, in her life time, as an American Nativer Indian, she went from living a Tee pee to owning a house with gas stove, air conditioner, flying in plane and driving a car as well as seeing man walk on the moon...

I'm glad someone or persons had the imagination to belive and develope such new .."out of this world" advances in technology... where would we be without them... we take so many for granted as if they were here since time begain....no!! they were developed from people who had knowledge and imagination and the drived to follow through.....

If all that technological advancement that happened in her life time, why is it so hard to believe that someone has developed or discovered a different kind of technology that can not be found by staring at a circuit board.....as I have said before on this site, this technology is beyond most peoples understanding and current level of knowledge.... The H3 is much like the science fiction novels of the late 1800's, the subject matter of many of those novels we take for granted today... and someday, you will take the technology of H3tec for granted as it becomes infiltrated into our everyday lives....But today... you still see the world as being flat when it is actually round.....


Good luck to you Carl,

Klondikeike

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Offline Carl-NC
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« Reply #38 on: August 16, 2010, 03:25:03 pm »
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Hello Ike,

I'm sure Mr. Christensen told you that I did offer him the $25,000 (plus other considerations) if he could successfully demonstrate the H3Tec device in a professionally administered randomized double-blind test. I'm sure he also told you that he responded with threats of a lawsuit if I didn't immediately surrender the device to him. I have the emails if you'd like to read them, although Mr. Christensen said they are "strictly confidential" and cannot be repeated to anyone. Wink

I will make the same offer to you: $25,000 if YOU as the operator can successfully demonstrate the H3Tec device in a professionally administered randomized double-blind test. There is one caveat: the prize money is only available if H3Tec agrees to the test and for you to officially represent the company. If you want to demonstrate the device on your own, independent of the company, then I am certainly interested (as I said in my email to you) but the prize money isn't available unless it's a sanctioned test.

Since Mr. Christensen doesn't seem to be interested in a truly scientific test of the H3Tec, maybe you are (I would be, if I were selling them). Let me know. And feel free to post the contents of our prior emails.



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« Reply #39 on: August 18, 2010, 03:02:45 am »
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Carl...

I see you didn't make any comments about your education level(s) and how you could possibly make such outlandish statements about the credibility of the H3 from H3tec... since you do know absolutely nothing about the technology behind the H3..... or how that   "... real circuit board..."   actually works....

Since the H3 is ONE OF A KIND, how would one go about a "PROFESSIONAL DOUBLE BLIND TEST"...Huh? Since there isn't anything to compare it too... The H3 is ONE OF KIND!!!! There is NO OTHER TECHNOLOGY around to compare to....There isn't a placebo.....Even if some way we all could agree to a test of this sort, neither H3tec nor myself want to TAKE your money from you,  it would be like taking candy from a baby... we are not about that at all...

Instead of clouding the issues with getting money involved, aLL that we ask of you is to visit SLC and take a test drive.... H3tec will NOT make any attempt to sell you an H3... this is simply a way for you to get FIRST HAND, working knowledge of the H3... This is ALL we have asked of you from day one... yet since day one you have refused...over and over again and again... instead, without any validation of the technology, you have made several attempts to discredit H3 and H3tec.. Yes, legal actions are coming, because you have made inappropriate statements without any merit of technology, education or experience to back them up....

Yes Mr. Christensen has repeatedly asked you to return the H3 property to H3tec because it is patented protected and is licenced ONLY to the original licensee... and there are several serious Federal laws governing the protection of licensed and patented protected devices and the tampering of those devices.....such as you have admittedly done... He was trying to save you a lot of serious legal headaches... but again this goes to show how little you understand the seriousness of these issues... I believe you called them "... threats and foot stomping..."... Wink... I'm afraid you hae really underestimated the H3, H3tec and Mr. Christensen....

As an example of the H3 abilities..  you could bury a single silver dollar or gold ring or something like these...2 feet in the ground... a 2 box will usually not see anything that small.. a metal detector will not usually see a small object like these that deep, but the H3 will find the dollar very easily every time....I've done it, and as part of my ADVANCED training class ... the students will located small items buried to depths up to 3 feet... (deeper if I wanted to dig deeper... items are hidden in a PVC tube buried to various depths to simulate something buried deeper than normal....).. as well as items located under water....behind buildings and structures and hidden behind steel structures, such as a safe and so forth....

Have someone place a silver or gold coin in the middle of 300 or more soda/beer can pull tabs....without your knowledge of the exact coin location cover it with some carpet so the coin and tabs cannot not be seen by you...I'm not an expert on Metal detectors, but I believe most brands would have a hard time detecting the coin through or around all that junk... how ever the H3 will see/hear the coin each and every time...I've actually done a similar test myself.....  As well as a friend of mine hid a 1 ounce vile of small grains of gold about 2500 feet from his house, and I found it with the H3, from his house, then drove/walked to it and pin-pointed it location and depth...... after finding it... he couldn't actually find the vile since he had buried it about 6in deep... and his metal detector wouldn't see it either... but the H3 saw it over and over again and again... and finally he screened some soil with his fingers, and there was the vile of gold his detector wouldn't see, but the H3e would.....

Yet these test are not "Professional and Scientific" type test.. as you are comparing a reflective signal metal detector to a device that has a totally different type of "hearing capacity"... not a detecting circuit at all...at least in the usual sense...

I have several private property owner negotiations currently going on over small to medium treasure caches I have located with the H3... there many legal reasons why I cannot disclose the location or the type of treasures located, but I have verified each cache with the Fisher 2 box detector..... the original locations were discovered using the H3 from distances up to a mile away, without ever setting one foot on the private property, then getting written permission to use the Fisher 2 box to validate my H3 findings... and now were are negotiating the actual dig and percentages....we hope to be digging in a couple of weeks.... on 2 different locations....There is NO way to set a test like that up with any other type of metal detecting device on the market today and make if a scientific and professional and legitimate and above all, a fair test....Your suggestion of a double blind test is noramally a good idea, but in this case, there isn't any way to fairly accomplish it...again this shows your lack of full understanding of what the H3 does, and is capable of... you are trying to compare what you know about modern metal detecting technology to something that is light years ahead of that type of technology... it is actually like comparing apples and oranges... both are round... but after that, they are very, very dissimilar....

Any additional comments on this or any other site from you or any associate of yours, about the H3 or H3tec will be met with silence from us, short of you visiting SLC... and it may already be too late for that kind of reconciliation at this time.... but you would need to speak to Mr. Christensen about that...if you have a mind to.

Good luck to you Carl,


Klondike

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