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Offline BitburgAggie_7377
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« Reply #70 on: February 01, 2010, 08:27:05 pm »
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Texas Jay,
      I will gladly retract my statement about KGCers only wanting funding since it really did NOT mean to imply that KGCers were out to con anyone or make a quick buck.   What I really meant to imply was that KGCers are always on the trail of a possible cache, but not particularly sure where it would be.   And because they aren't sure and are playing high stakes games, they have tendency to keep information pretty close to the vest......unlike some of the other groups here.    Besides, I find nothing dishonorable in seeking additional resources if you need them once you have reached the recovery point and have enough solid evidence to back up your claim.   

So I apologize for my poor wording.

BA

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« Reply #71 on: February 01, 2010, 09:14:47 pm »
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Quote:Posted by BitburgAggie_7377
Texas Jay,
      I will gladly retract my statement about KGCers only wanting funding since it really did NOT mean to imply that KGCers were out to con anyone or make a quick buck.   What I really meant to imply was that KGCers are always on the trail of a possible cache, but not particularly sure where it would be.   And because they aren't sure and are playing high stakes games, they have tendency to keep information pretty close to the vest......unlike some of the other groups here.    Besides, I find nothing dishonorable in seeking additional resources if you need them once you have reached the recovery point and have enough solid evidence to back up your claim.  

So I apologize for my poor wording.

BA

Spoken like a true gentlemen

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« Last Edit: February 01, 2010, 09:19:56 pm by outback »
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Offline raterry
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« Reply #72 on: February 01, 2010, 10:24:13 pm »
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Quote:Posted by cccalco
I have just joined this site. It was the info on the KGC that brought me on.


welcome and enjoy the ride. A lot of interesting info. Some maybe all could be true. 

RT
From what I have read about the KGC, they were amassing arms and monies during and after the civil war up until 1916. The coming of WW1 seems to have ended the movement.
Here are some letters from during the civil war relating to the KGC.

OFFICE OF THE PROVOST-MARSHAL, SEVENTH DISTRICT, NORTHWESTERN DIVISION,
Smithton, Worth County, Mo., February 12, 1863.
 Major-General CURTIS,  Saint Louis, Mo.:
DEAR SIR: The great anxiety I have for the restoration and perpetuity of our once happy country is the only excuse I have for again presuming to address you. I will not be tedious.
Cool deliberation and observation prove to us beyond doubt that our liberties, and the cause we fight to sustain, are eminently endangered by leading military men affiliating with sympathizers, and winking at their fiendish opposition to the Government. Persons from abroad are traveling through these upper counties by night, organizing Knights of the Golden Circle. One of those travelers became drunk, and fell into the hands of our unconditional Union men, who were initiated and let into the secret plans of operation, the most important of which was that there were 800 guns at Maryville, Nodaway County, and the same number at Albany, Gentry County, and that as soon as they could raise or initiate into the circle men to rise en masse and overpower the guards and take the guns for Jeff. Davis' use, they would do it.
As Col. Manlove Cranor and Lieut. Col. J. W. Curry, of Gentry County regiment, have declared boldly their opposition to the Administration and the war, it is believed that they, too, are Knights. Lieutenant-Colonel Cranor denounces us as unconditional negroes, and does all he dare do to encourage rebels and dishearten Union men. Our people call for a change. We are oppressed and discouraged, and cannot carry out your orders under the present rule. If the present going of things is not <ar33_110> checked, supporters of the Government, without regard to previous political opinions, will be down-trodden and driven from the country by secessionists under the garb of democracy.
Again we pray your honor to give us a brigadier of the type of Ben. Loan, and under officers to suit, that we may serve our country without being unjustly oppressive to any; otherwise our future is dark.
Believing that you have information from others also how matters have been going in this district, I subscribe myself, with much respect, your obedient servant,
 T. H. COLLINS,
Provost-Marshal.

HEADQUARTERS DISTRICT OF KANSAS,
Fort Leavenworth, Kans., April 17, 1863.
  Maj. Gen. SAMUEL R. CURTIS,
Commanding Department of the Missouri:
GENERAL: Recent telegraphic dispatches from Colonel Phillips (a synopsis of which was telegraphed you by my adjutant on yesterday during my absence at Kansas City) report that he has had two skirmishes with the enemy this side of the Arkansas River, completely routing them, killing their leader and a number of men, and driving them all across the river. Colonel Phillips is now occupying Fort Gibson with a portion of his command. The refugee Cherokees have arrived at their homes, and are putting in their crops. They are in fine spirits, and much pleased at the prospect of again occupying their country. Rebel forces on the south side of the river are guarding all the fords to prevent Union citizens from Southwestern Arkansas and Texas, as also well-disposed Choctaws and Creeks, from crossing over to join our forces. I have directed Colonel Phillips not to attempt to hold any position on the south side of the river, and to keep his forces within supporting distance, to prevent being attacked in detail by the enemy in force. It is quite evident that the rebels intend to make an effort to cross the river, and advance north through the Indian country. In my opinion their purpose is not to move through Missouri, but upon Kansas. This opinion is confirmed by information I obtain through the <ar33_224> Knights of the Golden Circle. I have a man who joined some time since in Missouri for certain purposes. He has been for some time with Todd's band of guerrillas in Jackson County, and is well posted in the working of the order, and the purposes for which they are organized. I expect to make a descent upon one of their lodges a few nights hence, and, if successful in taking them in, I think I shall hang all I catch. There are about 800 of them in Kansas and 10,000 in the State of Missouri. They are all sworn to support the Southern Confederacy, and are secretly procuring arms, and are confident that Price will succeed in invading Kansas and Missouri. Recruiting officers from Price's army are constantly arriving, and a regular correspondence by rebel mail is carried on between here and the rebel army. The plan of Price, as revealed by these Knights of the Golden Circle, is to make a feint with a small force in the direction of Springfield or Rolla, while with his main force he will move up the Arkansas, and through the Indian country upon Kansas, while the troops for the protection of this line are diverted for the protection of Rolla. Thus, in addition to being the most desirable plan for them--for there is no State they would so much like to devastate as this----it is the most feasible plan; for, leaving Fort Smith with ten days' supplies of rations, they could reach Fort Scott through a country well provided with grazing, provided there was no force to oppose them; whereas they cannot move a large army up through Arkansas, for the want of grass. Besides, there is nothing to attract them in Missouri, or supplies to sustain them, except the Government stores at the posts, which could be easily destroyed by us if necessary, while Kansas would furnish abundance of supplies after reaching her south border. We should not suffer ourselves to be deceived in regard to their anticipated movements. Whatever I may be able to learn through the "order" I will keep you posted in. The telegraph should not be used in making mention of the Knights of the Golden Circle. General Ewing has received orders from General Herron to join his command with the Kansas troops now in this district. I shall retain them in my district unless I receive orders from you to the contrary, as I believe that all of them and many more will be needed here before long.
I have the honor to be, general, respectfully, your obedient servant,
 JAS. G. BLUNT,

That is just 2 samples of Union correspondence relating to the KGC. So far I have gone through about 60 such correspondences and it seems that if there are to be caches found, most likely they will be found in the southwest and midwest United States.

RT


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« Reply #73 on: February 02, 2010, 05:08:35 am »
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Quote:Posted by Texas Jay
Here is a quote from GoldDigger1950's recent message on another subforum here.  I find this very strange since he is always demanding proof of KGC finds in this subforum.

" Cache hunters like to keep things close to the chest rather than blather them out in public forums."

This is one piece of advice that I think most of my fellow KGC hunters and I know I follow to the letter.  It's also wise to remember that there is much more competition to find KGC depository sites than there is your run-of-the-mill "post-hole bank" and that there are people who monitor all treasure hunting websites whose sole intention is to look for one of us to slip-up and release information about locations or finds so that either they or their employers can use that information to recover the KGC treasures themselves, thus beating us out of all the hard work we've invested in finding them in the first place. 
~Texas Jay



Jay, the trouble is that you cannot seem to read correctly. First of all, I do not demand proof. I simply say that what you present here is not truth or evidence. It is text, copied from one incorrect source to another. Eventually, those who are doing this smugly look at Google and believe that they have convinced the world of this so called "truth" because it shows up in 20 or more hits on Google. It's no more true than the first time it was typed.

You guys are believing your own hyperbole. When I say something is unproven, I mean just that. I have never in my life seen such shoddy research as what you KGC folks do. You use each other's posts as so called evidence. It's circular. You quote it here claiming it came from another forum while on that forum you claim it came from here so it must be fact. None of it is fact.

You guys are all playing video games. You'll never find anything using your research techniques. You seriously need help but you won't get it by insulting the folks here who offer you sound advice. You have nothing to keep close to your vest.

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« Reply #74 on: February 02, 2010, 07:42:04 am »
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Research is a very difficult chapter in treasure hunting  . All these stories of treasure caches are usually hear-say . One guy putting a story on the net and the other taking it for granted . The only good research is done in the archives . Usually a small article in a news paper will get you going . But .... that does not mean that the article was right . Court hearings are a good start . You have to get the written material from THAT time though . Not something that is written later by some fly by night reporter that wants to write an article because he is out of money and wants some attention . Sunken treasure is even harder to research . All that pirate stuff is just for armchair romantics . The truth is there but you have to dig for it in the archives and libraries all over the world . This is not easy but very rewarding . It is the history of all the known facts that make your heart beat faster when you are on the right track . This is more than a hobby , it is a life style . To want to know the real story , and not to read about it in the posts of somebody with an expanded sence of reality is what you are after . The smallest truth in a story is more important  than the story itself .  Just my idea .   Cornelius

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« Reply #75 on: February 02, 2010, 09:44:42 am »
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I agree Cornelius, but like with treasure hunting it seems most treasure hiders were secretive types and didn't leave maps with an x on it. I do see em on ebay though! Grin

No offense to anyone here as I am sure most folks are honest at heart but I believe no one posting on the web as a trusted source as saying something does or does not exist. If you dont post your name with a phd in THing behind it then who is to say what you are saying is true but research. Myself included. The internet is a wonderful tool, it brings many things to light we might not ever know about without it but it is just a starting point.

I take the clues and run em down if I am interested. If I can't match names dates and places I figure there isnt much point in looking. But I never fail to learn something even if its not what I thought I wanted.

Sunken treasure is an anomaly in treasure hunting as you generally know exactly what you are looking for. Ships manifests hold an amazing amount of detail as to just what all was in the hold. Problem is where it is, off the coast of africa or the pacific ocean somewhere  Grin That really narrows it down.... I love sunken treasure but as I am not a diver and don't live close to an ocean anymore I gotta look on dry land. I still like to read about others adventures though. Ive been reading treasure stories and archaeology books and such since I could first read. Its definitely a lifestyle.

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« Reply #76 on: February 02, 2010, 10:01:38 am »
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Idaho . Just look at the article on the Flor do Mar . I did my research and it was put on the net ( Google ) . Here is something of what you may say ,  it is just what this chap Cornelius wants to tell us , but is it tru ?  Well , there is a good question and if it was not for the fact that I researched the story and after that wrote it down for everybody to read  that question might well have some relevance . There is a difference in what you have heard and are passing on , and what you have researched and are passing on . The question you should always ask is who is the guy telling the story .   Cornelius

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« Reply #77 on: February 02, 2010, 10:35:42 am »
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"The question you should always ask is who is the guy telling the story "
Good question, Cornelius......and to it I would add "and what would he have to gain by misleading me?"

BA

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« Reply #78 on: February 02, 2010, 10:41:30 am »
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Aggie , what would he gain by misleading me  ?  Well , he wants to feel important .  Cornelius

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« Reply #79 on: February 02, 2010, 11:34:27 am »
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Very good points gentlemen, I have read through some of the Flor do Mar and it is quite an intriguing wreck a lot of info to digest.
I think its great that people share what they have learned and its why I come back here to this forum. Who knows someday I might find something because of info I read here. All in all its good fun seeing what comes to light. 

 

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